Lead Generation Systems Are As Brilliant As They Are LAME.

There are currently two main network marketing systems available online.
They are MLM Lead System Pro by Norbert O. and Ryan F., and the much newer 7 Figure Networker, by Jonathan Budd and Jason Shawver.
They are very similar in their aim: to provide fast and easy, duplicable marketing systems that anyone can use.
Each system provides pre-made capture pages, sales pages and email Auto Responders that are already written and ready to go. All you have to do is insert your unique link at the bottom of the page, or upload your personal video on their capture pages.
Such systems are as brilliant as they are l-a-m-e.
Here are the Pros and Cons about joining an online marketing "system"...
Why They're Awesome
Having your capture page, sales page, and auto-responders already created for you makes jumping into the game a cinch.
As a stay at home mom with a child under one year old, it has taken me exactly one week to set up my ENTIRE sales funnel from start to finish, including one written article with a link to MY unique affilate ID capture page. If my prospect enters their information, the receive an 8 Day Bootcamp with a follow up series provided.

The total amount of hours I spent working on setting all of this up was...get this...2 hours.
I don't have a lot of time on my hands, so it was an absolutely great feeling to have something "in place" in such a short amount of time. Now I can sit back and wait for the leads to come in! (yeah right)
Why Systems Suck
After I set up my marketing funnel, I went to my capture page and filled in my own information to test the system (which worked beautifully, might I add).
I checked my email account and sure enough, there was the first day of the 8 Day Bootcamp email sitting unopened in my inbox.
I opened the email, and as I read through I realized, Wow, this is so not me.
I didn't write the email - it was blatently obvious. Those words did not capture MY essence. And I personally think that being authentic, transparent and original are what get you places in business (especially when using social media marketing).
Another thing: I've seen SO many capture pages and sales pages out there. Honestly, if I click a link and see one of those pre-made identical pages with someone's video in the middle of the page, I close it within seconds. Don't care. Total loss of interest.
I think this might be a significant drawback to systems!
**** **** ****
As the weeks go on I will continue to document my experience using these two systems, first with Jonathan Budd's The 7 Figure Networker, and then moving on to thoroughly examine the inner workings of MLM Lead System Pro.
Go to my blog to stay up to date about this journey!

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About the Author: Kaitlin Rose

Member Since: 10/20/2008

Company: Kaitlin Rose Inc.

Industry: Education

Primary Web Site: http://www.mlmsystemscheck.blogspot.com


You make my job easier.

Thanks Katie,

With your help, I am able to learn the pros and cons of these systems - like what makes them brilliant, and what makes them lame. In the end, they seem more lame to me because they always sell the system, no matter how "customizable" they seem.

Then again, I watched you in just less than two hours this week put together a complete campaign with capture page, sales page, autoresponders, as well as two or three articles. It took me 6 months to do all that when I first got started.

Yours Truly,

Eric Walker — Mon, 10/26/2009 - 3:33pm

Two Hour Sales Funnel

It sure is tempting to jump at the idea of a two hour sales funnel set up from start to finish.

I will be very interested to follow your journey to see where it leads.

Your comments about generic,non-personalized marketing and support strike home. How easy is it to hit the delete button at first glance.

On the other hand, there may be much to learn to add to the process of attraction marketing from this experience. Will follow with interest.

Pat Campbell — Mon, 10/26/2009 - 6:21pm

Happy to Help

Eric - it's my pleasure to help you in any way I can so that we can reach our goals all the faster.

Pat - glad this little experiment sparked your interest! It is going to be interesting to see what results I get from each system and approach.

Kaitlin Rose — Mon, 10/26/2009 - 7:17pm


I find your "experiment" interesting and looking forward to your future updates. If a system can save time, or make the job a little easier that's great, but it must also allow the "real" you to show through to your prospects.

Dr. David Enders — Mon, 10/26/2009 - 10:48pm

Autoresponder problems

Hi Katie,
I wonder whether the autoresponder in these two systems is actually something reputable like Aweber or whether it is something created by the designer of the lead generation system. I am not familiar with either of the two programs though I have listen to the pitch in the past. I did however buy into a similar system set up by a top producer in my MLM company. There was however less customizing. It did have a backoffice contact system and pre-written autoresponder messages like yours.

However, here was the kicker. Almost all of the messages went into junk mail. Why? Because the system creator and owner had no credibility with the major server owners around the world the way Aweber and other major emailing autoresponders do. So, eseentially the value of the entire system was worthless because of that.

So that would be a critical consideration in evaluating these programs I would think. For example, do they allow for double opt in. But more importantly, do they have the clout of Aweber when dealing with Yahoo, Verizon, AOL, ATT, HotMail, and so on.

Richard Goutal — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 12:10am

pre-fab construction vs. ground up

Katie - great experiment and I look forward to following the results. If you liken this to construction, you can think of it in terms of pre-fab construction vs. ground up. With pre-fab, the components are largely there and you just put it all together. Ground up requires more work, but you can tailor things much more.

While I believe in leveraging my time and not reinventing the wheel, I tend to favor the stability and customization of a ground up project. Okay, enough analogies. Please keep us posted. thanks!

Cindy Schulson — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 12:39am


The 7 Figure Networker system is actually quite customizable.

You don't need to be concerned about the quality of the autoresponder as you have a choice of using either Aweber or GetResponse. You get your own Aweber or GetResponse account and plug it into the system. The cool thing about this is that the leads come directly to you and belong to you. They don't belong to the "system".

As to the emails, you can load them up with your own email series. The system provides its own autoresponder series so you can get up and running quickly but you are definitely free to use your own.

The lead capture pages are also customizable. Again, there are sample pages provided but you can use your own. There are templates available so putting up your own is really quite easy. You can use your own pictures or videos, etc.

The 7 Figure Networker system also has extensive video training available that is included in the price of the system. This training includes social media, SEO, PPC, etc. I am pretty sure that MLM Lead System Pro has training in their back office as well.

Hope that provides a bit more insight into the 7 Figure Networker system.

Cheers! C Doug Mah

Calvin Mah — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 1:11am

Great Marketing Angle

Kaitlin, this is a great way to bring good value to the market place and get great exposure for yourself. Definitely the heart of attraction marketing. Keep up the good work.

I'll be following along to see your experience and results with the systems.

Claire Covington — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 10:56am

I Had One and Left

I know exactly what you are going through, Kaitlin. I used to belong to that "other" one you mentioned. It didn't take me long though to find out that although the pages were all ready for you minus a few links, that as you say, "it didn't capture your essence". So I modified each email to reflect my personality better.
In the end, I left because there was something missing from the whole equation and now here I am at R.Prof. and am I ever happy I made the transition.
I haven't looked back since!

Marie Leonard — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 11:33am

Why Do This Anyway?

Hey everybody, thanks for your comments.

This is going to be an interesting and informative journey I am embarking on, and sure am glad to have you cheering me on from the sidelines.

I want to clear something up, really get down to the point of WHY I am doing this to begin so none of you feel you have to defend one system or the other (although I appreciate your opinions and reflections).

The whole reason WHY I am looking into these systems and running the PREMADE campaigns, is to objectively see how many qualified leads these systems can pull in using those cookie-cutter templates (if any at all).

I made myself clear about where I stand on sending out emails written by the creator of a system (if it's not You, it's not True).

And yet, it FELT GOOD to get that campaign set up so quickly, which made me think about all of those who struggle to get going - it can take months to set up an entire sales funnel, even to understand what a sales funnel even IS!

I'm not your average beginner, in fact, I'm not even a beginner. I have a clear knowledge of the basic elements of the process.

Stay posted! I'll be back!
Kaitlin Rose

Kaitlin Rose — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 1:02pm

I don't see much customization

For the most part, I don't see much customization. Sure some people might plop their video in the center of these pages, but that's about it. I have opted into many of these systems and none (NONE) have customized the email. Yes, I realize that the systems can be customized a lot, but I've yet to see it. Maybe someone reading this who has customized can elaborate how they did so.

Eric Walker — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 1:33pm

Something to Think About

Hi Kaitlin,

I look forward to following your progress and results. It may not be then end all to be all but it might be a place for someone to start if you see any results from it.

I think they also might be a good way to see how a marketing system is set up for someone just starting out online (unlike yourself).

I know I have been doing it the "hard" way but I know in the end it will work out. But you are so right - It takes time and the development of skills.

Can't wait for the updates.

Samantha Gardner — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 2:03pm

Hats Off to You

Thank you for taking on this task and reporting it to us! I love when I read about real people taking on something like this and getting the big picture through their eyes. So many times when you read through all the testimonials that come with all the online marketing systems, you have to wonder to yourself....."Really??"

Now we will know with someone from our "family" actually taking it for a test drive!

LeeAnn McVey — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 2:19pm


Kaitlin, this is awesome! Thank you for taking time to evaluate this system and give us feedback. It is much appreciated!

Michelle Moseley — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 5:43pm

The Right Person for the Job

Hi Kaitlin,

I look forward to your experience using the two systems. You are definitely not a beginner. You have a high level of marketing and technical experience. You're the right person to evaluate the systems.

A few months ago, I was able to look at most of the auto responder messages coming from MLM Lead System Pro. They were supposed to be educational, but I considered them very promotional. However, I'm not sure how much of those messages could be customized.

Based on Doug's comments, 7 Figure Networker might be a better fit. I look forward to your reviews of the systems. Great article.

Scott Hubbard — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 7:58pm

Another Perspective

I have people in my primary biz dowline using MLMLSP. Initially I was concerned about all the reasons you suggest for it being LAME. But what I've come to learn is that every aspect of the system can be customized..from the copy on the template capture pages, to every word in the autoresponder emails. The emails get loaded into YOUR autoresponder..in this case the people are using Aweber.

As someone who set up every one of my lead generating "systems" from scratch...prior to MLMLSP or Renegade Pro, or 7 Figure Networker even existing..I know how confusing and time consuming it can me.

Now as a frontline distributor working hard to get new people up and running online as quickly as possibly, I too am exploring all the different "pre-fab" systems out there. My gut feeling is they are the way to go for real beginners who need the great feeling of success that you had Katie, when you got it all up and functioning so quickly. As people become more experienced in the technical aspects and the overall conceptual understanding of lead generation, it is then that I would suggest a more in depth training system that teaches the next level of personal branding in the online marketing world.

Systems don't have to compete. They can actually complement each other. As for "pre-fab" vs. "custom". The most assumed aspects of pre-fab houses are no longer what is real in the new home market. Many fully customized homes are being build in a "pre-fab" manner...and with all green materials to boot..and saving time and money due to so much being build indoors rather than onsite. The industry has changed. The same may end up being true here. We'll have to do our research and see.

Peace and Abundance,

Deborah Tutnauer — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 10:03pm

My No Competition Clause

For the record - this article was in no way intended to compare or contrast systems vs. do it yourself.

I feel diplomatic by saying, 'I believe each has it's place; it's season for each particular user.' :)

Thanks for your comments,

:-) Hi Kaitlin, I bet you wonder how I edited your comment! (from Mike Klingler... its an old Jedi Mind Trick)

Kaitlin Rose — Tue, 10/27/2009 - 10:39pm

Great Discussion

I've read through everyone's comments--there are some fantastic contributions here.

Kudos Kaitlin for taking this on and keeping us informed--I love it!

My two cents--

The biggest challenge I see with any system that promotes itself (customizable or not) is they lead to the same place. In fact, that's the very point of them and its what always does them in, in the end.

Problem: They saturate quickly because their very purpose is to create an army of people who all promote the exact same system designed to promote the exact same system.

(If you notice I repeat some things here, it's for effect--because its very similar to what happens when a growing group of people all promote the exact same system that's designed to promote the exact same system)...

I understand there is some level of 'arguable' customization provided in the recent systems (emails, lead capture copy, etc)--however, these still all lead to selling the exact same system. Therefor, they really aren't customizable.

The market can only bear so many people promoting the exact same system that allows them to "customizably" promote the exact same system.

This is why I now only promote systems and tools that allow people (beginners and advanced) to use templates, to customize, but that ALSO teach people to create their own marketing funnels that are independent of promoting just one system... and that teach them how to provide value that attracts prospects to them regardless of any one system.

This doesn't mean I'm saying NOT to use systems that are designed to get more people to get more people to promote that one system.

That's not what I'm saying here.

What I'm saying is that if that's all one knows and does, they have a HUGE, grotesque disadvantage.

And business is tough enough without piling on the disadvantages.

It's an illusion and a high gamble proposition if that's all one is doing or encouraging others to do (I'm talkin' worse odds and more at risk than betting 3 months' worth of home mortgage payments at the craps table in Vegas).

What's worse is that newbies (who are not yet smart beginners) don't know the level of harm in using just ONE system that's only purpose is to get more people to promote it to get more people to promote it -- they don't realize how often this leads to eventual self doubt and failure in business altogether because of all the energy and time that went into trying to make something work only to fail once more.

That's why its best to be upfront with beginners if you refer them to such systems and tell them straight away that its not the only thing they'll have to use... it's not the only thing for them to learn... that they should study it, use it, but that there is MORE to do.

Minimize Risk In Business

If you and your team can create their own marketing funnel, and learn how to stand out from the crowd by creating their own grand opus (high value) that attracts prospects differently than everyone else does... THEN they can succeed no matter what happens.

Without that being the main plan, it's all a huge grotesque risk.

Again, so not be misunderstood:

Tools are good.

Systems are good.

Even systems designed to get more people to promote themselves 'can' be good.

But if a person isn't operating beyond using ONE system that's designed to get more people to promote it, they're in trouble.

Most importantly--

If a person is promoting a "customizable" system that's designed to promote the exact same system--I personally feel its exceptionally dis-empowering and financially dangerous to lead others to believe that THAT system is the ONLY solution.

Use it if you like, if it fits in your model.

Share it with others if it serves their needs... but be upfront about the fact that its not the whole enchilada.

They will respect you for it.

Telling people the 'rest of the story' is one great way to stand out from the crowd. I suggest making this a part of your brand to do so.

It is more attractive.

Attracting Better Downline

You'll attract better quality people to you if you tell the whole story.

Because the best prospects won't believe that a system that promotes the exact same system will set them free anyway.

Only the ones who want a lottery ticket will buy into that pitch (and there are a lot of those, but are they getting anywhere... is associating with those people or enrolling them getting YOU anywhere)?

Rant over :-)

Can't wait to hear more about your journey here Kaitlin!

I think I know where it leads...

To GOOD stuff!

Mike Klingler — Wed, 10/28/2009 - 4:18am

Authentic + Transparent + Original = Kaitlin

YOU hit THE nail on the HEAD with this one...

"Those words did not capture MY essence. And I personally think that being authentic, transparent and original are what get you places in business (especially when using social media marketing)."

Katie...NOT only can YOU sing...


Eric...YOU got QUITE the package with HER!

Glad to KNOW YOU both...

YOU have a VERY BRIGHT future ahead...;)

Later Gators!

Shelly 'CAN DO' Allen

PS - Give that cute little Ella Rose a (((squeeze))) for ME!

Shelly Allen — Wed, 10/28/2009 - 12:52pm

My Thoughts Exactly Mike

So much of the error with any program, is the notion that one size fits all people, all situations, all of the time. I instead see most systems, training, methods, etc...as arrows in one's quiver. For me, as a coach and trainer as well as a business owner, I love having a large selection of tools to choose from when I'm working with an individual, or with my team. In my own primary business, I choose my arrows depending on the target, the wind and the ultimate goal.

I feel it's not even ethical to lead anyone to believe that one system is the only answer, nor the be all and end all. Rather, I like to offer the right tool, to the right people at the right moment, as well as offer alternatives along with pros and cons based on research and experience. I also make them aware that as they learn, grow and change, they may find a need for a different system, or training or even mentor. They should know that it's not only OK to change and search, but in fact it's expected...

Your research Katie, is right in keeping with this mind-set and I'm looking forward to your ongoing and final thoughts.

Peace and Abundance,

Deborah Tutnauer — Wed, 10/28/2009 - 11:23pm

Systems for recruiting or for marketing


I completely agree with you, budding business owners need to learn how to build their own sales funnel. And at that point, let's take it one step further. The self-replicating system, where people are lured with the promise of easy business building, just to receive the tools to promote the system -- is not that what happens when we are leading with the business opportunity rather than with the products?

Let's come back to where direct marketing and attraction marketing started, with marketing products and services.Marketing products and services is the basic purpose of every MLM home business, and the only source of business revenue. This is where all business training needs to start.

Recruiting distributors is a second step, once you have a profitable business with a working sales funnel in place. Train your people to operate the funnel, and they have a chance at succeeding.

If all we do is to give them sophisticated recruiting tools, and leave them with "make a list of 100 people" for selling their products, are we not creating a self-replicating system of recruiters learning how to recruit more recruiters?

I'd love to hear your thoughts.


kdruhl (not verified) — Fri, 10/30/2009 - 2:46pm

It's About => OPTIONS

GREAT discussion - important - very timely - thanks Kaitlin.

The main theme here centers around two (2) particular PRE-MADE Marketing Systems, which is fine.

But here's my own take on this, overall...

(1)- BEST - "create our OWN" Marketing System / Funnel - from scratch (quality training needed).

(2)- SECOND BEST - same as in #1 - but have it done by OUTSOURCING it to others, who already have the expertise (some good ones out there).

(3)- THIRD BEST - Go with one of the (many) PRE-MADE Systems - Johnathan's and Norbett's being two of the most popular.


Personally, I agree with Deborah Tutnauer's comments above on this issue.

Everybody has different skills, experiences, backgrounds, interests, finances, time constraints, technical limitations, etc, etc.

I believe that there IS a place for each of (1) - (2) - (3) above - and there could be 'major' discussions / debates on each of them.

I believe there is no "ONE shoe fits ALL" - and that we as leaders, should explain a MENU of different choices (even though some will disagree, as they feel this will simply confuse prospects).

I believe we have a responsibility to lay out the many PROS and CONS of each option - and to give our guidance, as to the "best" option(s) for a particular individual, as we see it.

Just my own 03-cents worth (Canadian).

Warmly / Peter A.

Peter Arnold — Sat, 10/31/2009 - 1:04pm

Hey Katie, You are 100%

Hey Katie, You are 100% correct!!

Katie Wrote:
"I've seen SO many capture pages and sales pages out there. Honestly, if I click a link and see one of those pre-made identical pages with someone's video in the middle of the page, I close it within seconds. Don't care. Total loss of interest."

This is why taking the time to setup a completely unique and personalized website instead of using a pre-generated capture page will always win hands down. The pre-generated capture page is nice for the beginner to recruit beginners into their business but that is about it. The ones that have the same person on the video is hilarious. Let's help build someone else Internet presence? Lmao!

In the end people still have to find and generate the traffic flow to the system anyways so why not generate and build the popularity of your own personalized website?

To your success,
Cliff Covill

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