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[george Ruiz Company: Isagenix Corporation Contribution Level: 4]

Well, with all the excitement, Mike Dillard deserves a HUGE applause, not many trainers or gurus I know can be so open to suggestions, and be a fast decision maker..

I have to confess that when I heard the first time about magnetic sponsoring, I have my doubts about Mike, but the more I got to know him and his work, the more I understand his success, and the more I admire him.

And of course my congratulations to Dean, I am new here but I already see why you were nominated..

And James, congratulations for a great idea, in my short time here I enjoy your expertise and passion.

George Ruiz

[Daniel Attard Company: Neways Worldwide Contribution Level: 3]

James...did you buy Traffic Cipher and test it? How would you know what its like and what results it causes? Just curious mate.

Daniel Attard

[Rasheed Bustamam Company: Numis Network Contribution Level: 2]

Isn't it still spam if Ferny continually posts his links about SEO?

Or is it waived when other people post about SEO in their excitement about it?

I don't know anything about SEO, so I wasn't interested in Traffic Cipher, but I am interested in what James has to say about it because I have heard a LOT about it recently...

[Rasheed Bustamam Company: Numis Network Contribution Level: 2]

I do not buy IM junk unless I want to test it to warn my members against bad practices .... I have no need to buy it because I have seen the post by ferny and I know what it offers. I have seen his site and I know it is not SEO'ed, should not be teaching on SEO when you can not even SEO your own site.

Now I run his site through The Dominator and what do I find ... Blogs that have been spammed, this is certainly not a good sign. Some have even went to the point that they have removed the spam comments such as Mike Mundell.. Any one of my members can run his site through The Dominator and see exactly what I mean.

I do my research and I am very good at it after all these years... I do not go jump and buy a product because 1,000 blind followers that do not know how to do research says to buy it.

The fact that he must spam this forum to get opt-ins so he can spam then with his junk should tell you something...

James

James...did you buy Traffic Cipher and test it? How would you know what its like and what results it causes? Just curious mate.

Daniel Attard

I actually just quit a company that sold a non-working juice for $45, so I know exactly what you mean. Blind followers will follow hype; not research.

I encourage everyone to do their research on any product they are told to buy. My lead system generator MLSP just recently promoted Traffic Cipher and I did not buy it just because I was told to. It's the same in any company, not just Internet marketing companies. Gurus are human too, you know.

Also, the "have you tried x" argument doesn't work. It's impossible to try everything in the world. Yet we know that a lot of things are good or bad. For example, (you don't need to answer this question) have you tried crystal meth? You don't need to try it to know it's bad. An expert like James doesn't need to try an internet marketing product in order to know that it is bad.

[Richard Bravo Company: Life Force International Contribution Level: 9]

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@Dean ... don't be so quick to throw down your membership just yet bro.
We need you here. (read below)


@James ...
I see your point and I see an opportunity.
The opportunity is one to turn this place around.

No one can deny this site has bad ass pull on many levels.

What I would really love to see is people like you, Dean and a few others rally together, in a positive, but dramatically effective way, to clean this place up.

As you've already stated and I agree, if the losers that choose to employ stupid tactics to exploit and game the system are stopped dead in their tracks to begin with, then there's very little "clean up" that needs to be done and we can all get on with the business of sharing quality content again.

Moderators are a HUGE factor.
But then the dilemma is WHO do you turn the keys over to?
Moderators need to be unbiased at a high level as to not abuse the system themselves.
Like a good judge, prudence must be employed and justice must prevail above opinions.

Something else I learned a long time ago is that ... Common Sense Is Not Very Common.
And inevitably someone will argue, as has already been done here, that what's "right" to me, may not be "right" to you.

So while I agree that there needs to be a level of "best judgment" allotted to users and the material they post, in contrast to trying to enforce a blanket rule like "no links ever - period," which is a great disservice to the community in my opinion, some sort of clear guidelines must be posted that address multiple scenarios, in addition to "use your best judgment" with a strict warning that anyone abusing that freedom will be punished.

Secondly, I fully agree that at the root level measures must be taken as you've outlined to combat the problems internally. I'm in the middle of setting these parameters in my own community and it isn't that difficult. More than anything it takes a good understanding of what you want to do more than the "technical" side of making it a reality.

So I think your input on the specs should serve as a great place to start.

Lastly, and this is going to sting a bit, we must all be PROFESSIONALS when it comes to how we enforce things. As anyone knows I have no problem calling someone out for blatantly taking advantage of the fact that the forum is not moderated. However, with that we must maintain composure and not allow ourselves to engage in petty "playground" banter, name calling and insults.

I've definitely let my temper get the best of me a few times and I know how frustrating it is to see the spammers come here and openly get away with it. Especially considering how hard we work to provide true value in every way.

But this unfortunately will decay anything positive that we can accomplish in all other areas if we do not set a standard.

Wyatt Earp was quick to pistol whip a thug when it came down to it ... but he was stone cold smooth most of the time and quite reserved ... leaving the gun fight for those that just wouldn't listen once direct contact was made and a plea to correct their ways was ignored.

We have to do the same.
Ghandi said it best ... "Be the change you want to see in the world."

We must be the beacon and maintain a stone cold smoothness when it comes down to showing people the right way to interact here. And more so, not gun down every citizen that jwalks - but rather, issue words of caution. There's good people here, but this place has been a free for all, so it needs to be done gently with patience and understanding, rather than a sledgehammer.

Next and this is a big one ... RULES of the ABN MUST BE ENFORCED!
I've sat quietly for a looooong time watching as people post articles and videos and other content in the forum knowing damn well that the PRIVELEDGE of posting articles, videos and blog posts on this site is supposed to be reserved for ABN members. It's one of the reasons I joined the ABN to begin with. Sure the training in the vault is good, but I wanted the access for posting that type of content. Easily worth the $10 to me if the lams ass spammers were going to be diluted. But that has not been the case.

Closing the doors has only made it worse. Now the forum posts that should be in the article section (behind PAID doors) has increased 10x or more. But enforcement has gone unchecked so they get away with it.

AND, for those that apparently don't know better or "naively" overlooked the rules ... these people get slammed (hard), because they are in the wrong place at the wrong time and are getting a dose of anger built up from all the real spammers and they get crushed.

Again, moderation and crystal clear (practical) guidelines would fix so much of this.


Anyway ...
I'm just rattling things off the top of my head.
I know we can make this a better place, and I truly hope we can do it soon before the decay is too much to handle.

I'd really like to become more active again, but I can't stand the blatant abuses taking place without any measures to put it in check. I know Mike has stated several times that "it's coming" so we need to be patient and keep moving forward. In the mean time, my suggestion is this ...

Let's ban together to dominate with KICK ASS value so much so that we simply over shadow the bullshit so it has no room to breath. If things don't change, well like I said, my own community is just launching and I'm already a member in yours ... so there are alternative spaces available.

Time will tell.

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[Rasheed Bustamam Company: Numis Network Contribution Level: 2]

Dean,

I know who you're talking about (in regards to saying you don't belong here), and I really disagree with him. BN is a social community for any sort of home business owner, not just MLM.

I think it's really appalling that a person who would call out Dean is recognized as an instructor on this site. Instructors are supposed to be respected; when I first joined this site, I looked at all of the instructors so I would know whose posts I should look for. But then I saw one instructor attacking Dean in one of my topics, and also attacking James, and now I don't really know who to trust.

There are some people who should be instructors that shouldn't (coughcoughDean) and there are some people who shouldn't be instructors but are.

Instructors are supposed to be people who new people to the industry can respect and emulate after. Attacking other high-contributing users is not something I'd like to emulate after. I don't think it matters how much money you make, though that's always a plus; it matters more about how many people you help out. Personally, I don't care how much money someone makes (or claims to make) [and don't get me wrong, I am happy for you if you make $100k per month, but it doesn't really affect me], I want to know how many people they help and how their teaching methods are.

Those are just my two cents...

[Mike Dillard Company: Magnetic Sponsoring Contribution Level: 5]

I appreciate the feedback guys, and you're absolutely correct about the ABN stuff. Unfortunately some people will leak past us because we're just not staffed to moderate micro-level issues like this at the moment. I should have an update on when we'll be able to appoint moderators by tomorrow.

Mike

[Daniel Attard Company: Neways Worldwide Contribution Level: 3]

Thanks Mike! Good to know we are talking sense then

Daniel Attard

[Gregory Elfrink Company: ViSalus Sciences Contribution Level: 3]

Anyone that attacks Dean is attacking me.

I am all for the ABN mission, I just joined it. I say kick whatever instructor out of being an instructor. Instructors are not suppose to attack people even if they believe they are wrong, that is paradoxical for the whole term instructor.

I love Dean, he's pretty much has added value to every single forum post ever on BN, can't say that about many people if any.

Glad to see Mike's response though about getting moderators for this stuff. Hope you stay a member of ABN even if you're not a networker Dean.

Maybe we should start a mlm where we sell monthly forum posts of Dean as our autoship

[Don Egnor Contribution Level: 4]

I appreciate the feedback guys, and you're absolutely correct about the ABN stuff. Unfortunately some people will leak past us because we're just not staffed to moderate micro-level issues like this at the moment. I should have an update on when we'll be able to appoint moderators by tomorrow.

Mike

Mike,

I have asked to be a moderator on BN but from what I understand if I am a member then I can't be a moderator...please see info from the Help Desk.

Betternetworker Tech 2, Nov 24 08:46 am (CST):
Don,

Thanks for your inquiry and willingness to assist with site moderation, currently our policy does not allow for community members to be moderators. If this policy should change in the near future, there will be a posting made on the site.

Thanks,

Betternetworker Support Team

I would love to help out but not sure if it is even possible. I feel I have a good reputation on this site and am looking to help any way I can in order to make it a better place for everyone. I understand the rules for being a moderator but I would think it is something to possibly take a look at because it is obvious there is help needed to get things under control so I am here if BN needs me.